This Is What Democracy Looks Like, Pt. 2

BallerStatus.com: Why does society perceive Islam as the religion of violence? Eric Rudolph was a hardcore Christian. Ted Bundy was Vice President of the local Methodist Youth Fellowship growing up. McVeigh was raised as a devout Roman Catholic...

Rep. Ellison: Well the thing is people fear what they don't know. There are people who are Muslim who claim Islam in doing horrible things, but there are a lot of other people that don't claim Islam at all, like Timothy McVeigh, who does horrible things. I don't run around as the spokesman for Muslim Americans, but everyone knows I'm Muslim, and when they see me they're like, "Well that guy seems ok." You can't tell me that all Muslims are the same. We have these stereotypes, sometimes without even trying.

BallerStatus.com: It's fear. In the 50s it was the commies. In the 60s, the hippies, then in the 80s, the homosexuals.

Rep. Ellison: Every era has its boogeyman. But you know what though? People will be surprised. You go to the doctor. He might be Muslim. The nurse who was so nice to you might be. It shouldn't matter. You shouldn't say, "Oh there's a good one." There are probably a whole lot of people we encounter every day that we don't know that we don't the background of, we don't ask of the faith of everyone we meet. There are good decent people just trying to make it like everybody.

BallerStatus.com: What were your thoughts on the Democratic debate the other week? It's early, but the election for President has never been this wide open.

Rep. Ellison: Nobody really broke out of the pack for me. I'm looking for some bold ideas. I'm looking for something strong on climate change. I'm looking for somebody to say that this war was wrong from the start and we have to get out right away.

BallerStatus.com: Gravel said that. Hell, he screamed it. Economic plans aren't a strong point for him though.

Rep. Ellison: We need someone to stand up for the working class people. Who's going to look out for them? Forty-seven million Americans don't have healthcare.

BallerStatus.com: Don't be such an idealist. Think of how boring life would be if you never got sick. How the heck could you cut class? Or take two weeks off of work with a "stomach bug" when you're really at a cheap motel in South Dakota in the company of a lady of the night who doesn't have a last name?

Rep. Ellison: I'm going to say this. I had a situation man, when I was campaigning where I ran into a guy who was making twelve bucks an hour, didn't have healthcare. He went up on his roof, the roof was leaking and he couldn't hire a guy to do it because... he couldn't hire a roofer because he had no money. He went up there, fell off the ladder, and hurt his back then went to the doctor and got a huge medical bill. He put it on the credit card, then got jacked on the credit card. He was late on it and...

BallerStatus.com: You could go on forever with this one.

Rep. Ellison: It's just terrible man. It's like a parade of bad luck. And the working class people of this country deserve a whole lot better. I'm going to tell you, if the average working person in this country had a healthcare system to go to, a decent wage to live on, you would find that the people at the top of the country would do even better because others could afford to buy some of this crap.

BallerStatus.com: Life is luck. If you're tall, you play basketball. If you can sing, then you sing. If you're a pretty white girl with blonde hair, that's it, end of story, you just have to wake up every morning and get out of bed, there's no worries. For the rest of us, we need someone watching out.

Rep. Ellison: Everybody does better, when everybody does better. I need somebody to speak up for the working people of this country.

BallerStatus.com: Are you not paying attention? That's exactly what you're doing, right now.

Rep. Ellison: That's what I'm looking to hear.

BallerStatus.com: Do you feel the nation is too preoccupied as a whole with other matters? It seems if the millions that want to end the war marched on the capitol, it would benefit the cause?

Rep. Ellison: I think you're right. Let me just tell you what I'd like to do. I think that a lot of young folks love politics by the way. If you only would talk to them straight up and say, "Look here's how you can get involved to change your life for yourself, your momma and whomever." They are open to things. It's because people have been taught that it won't work. We have to go back to that time when young people were involved in politics and really were changing the landscape of the country. But young people are doing some good things today too. Whenever I go around this country and talk to folks, I see a lot of young people leading the way on housing policy, on peace. If it weren't for young people, there would be nobody talking about global climate change. In fact, Al Gore can tell you some of the most effective advocates have been young people. I met a really young civilian who had gotten active down in New Orleans after Katrina, who had become politically lit up.

I think hip-hop has got a lot of potential. I remember when hip-hop was much more political. That was back in the day of Public Enemy. Chuck D, he's the man. But I remember... I even like the kid from Detroit. His stuff is political too. Eminem, he speaks to the pain of a generation, whether black or white. He's a white rapper, but the black kids like him because he's for real. They understand that he's really speaking to their reality. We need more rappers in hip-hop who will do that again. We need to get back more to the spray painters and the DJs... and turn away from the people who are trying to turn everything into craft commercialism.

BallerStatus.com: It's refreshing to hear an elected official say that. In the wake of the Imus incident, it's amazing how the barrel of the gun was aimed back in the other direction, towards hip-hop. There seems to be a belief that violence is rooted in hip-hop, even though David Allen Coe was singing "take the sheets up off your bed, and let's go hang a n-----," decades before the first MC came around.

Rep. Ellison: The thing is... And I remember it like it was yesterday, one moment we were talking about fighting the power, then the next we were talking about Gin & juice. I believe the music industry saw all these jacked up young people trying to change the system and said, "Let's get them drunk and have them turn on each other." You know what I mean? That's why underground hip-hop has such tremendous potential, because it can't be controlled. If somebody is talking about something worthwhile like changing reality, that's catchy. And people want to hear about fighting the power. They also want to hear about, when they're demoralized beat up and beat down, the talk of "gin & juice" because that's a way to escape the negatives of your life too. You can get hooked on any drug. Sex is a drug, that's why they shake them booties in front of us all the time. And they get you caught up on a hedonistic lifestyle that doesn't lead anywhere. It's all drugs, sex and rock & roll, as opposed to changing the system, or making sure that individuals have a real say, or fighting for human rights and the environment. The economic system is unfair. They don't want young people focused on that. Young people have to focus themselves on that. You can do that if you use hip-hop in a positive way.

BallerStatus.com: But how ironic was it for people like Sean Hannity and Glenn Beck to even bring up so called "dangerous rappers" or "snitching" when they preach racism and hate speech on the radio every day?

Rep. Ellison: Oh man, they get up there and speak that nonsense constantly. The fact of the matter is, now matter how you feel about Don Imus, there's a whole lot worse than him on the radio. He was a sacrificial lamb.

BallerStatus.com: He's a comedian. These others will say that "Muslims are inherently evil" or "illegal immigration is the work of Satan" and pass it off as serious political and social commentary. With Imus, half of his audience laughed and the other half hissed, but it's doubtful that many a listener of his went home that night actually believing that the Rutgers ladies were a squad full of dirty prostitutes.

Rep. Ellison: If the whole Imus ordeal serves anything it should be to get people to be refocused on what the real agenda is. I mean we're getting confused by stuff. For example, there are a lot of young black women who have gone out there and worked hard to be successful in life. These young women were in college, playing basketball. That's what we want our daughters doing. Maybe it was wrong for Imus to crack on them like that, but at the end of the day, we still have to keep pushing the doors of opportunity for everybody. We have to make sure that people feel respected in the society we live in.

BallerStatus.com: During that time period, while racism was all in the news, Alberto Gonzales was testifying before the Senate over firing those attorneys. They were fired in an effort to influence the Presidential election of 2008, because they will suppress the minority vote, again, and the attorneys who choose whether or not to investigate and prosecute that issue will have been replaced by robots. That's real racism. Anyway besides the war, what are you focused on in the coming months?

Rep. Ellison: One thing I want to work on is the credit justice issue. I mean the fact is a lot of people who aren't making much money will turn to credit cards to make it. If you're late on the credit card, every credit card you own will increase your rates up to as high as 32%. That means it's expensive to be poor, because the poor pay more. It shouldn't be like that. It should be the opposite if nothing else. So I'm trying to do something about these credit cards. I'm trying to do something with these pay day loans. You know? You get behind and then get a pay day loan, and then end up paying 500% on that loan. It's really outrageous that a lot of young people get caught in that trap. They don't fully explain the adjustable rate mortgages. Then it's up to the point where you can't pay the mortgage no more and its foreclosure. So we're trying to deal with that.

You can't address poverty without talking about money. It's amazing how ignorant we are as a society about money. I'm talking about me too. My wife and I bought a house, and to tell you the truth, I don't know what's in all those documents. It was signed so fast. And you know, you get some 24 or 25-year-old person who says, "Well I'm going to buy me a house." Well good, but you might have just bought a whole lot of trouble. We need to do something about that. So I'll be hard on the credit justice issue. Also peace is a big deal for me, not only domestically, but internationally. We have to deal with Israel-Palestine. That's a conflict that needs to be resolved. American people need to say that that's a conflict that needs to be resolved. Al-Qaeda recruits, in part, by saying they're sticking up for the Palestinians, so we've got to work on that.

BallerStatus.com: Most are in deep poverty over there.

Rep. Ellison: They're in deep poverty. They're in a bad situation. And the Israelis need to agree that reconciliation needs to happen with Palestine. There's nobody to pull them together to work it all out. The United States hasn't been active in that process for over six years.

BallerStatus.com: What other Congressman was it again that was so outraged by your election?

Rep. Ellison: Virgil Goode.

BallerStatus.com: There was that video clip of you, on the first day of the 110th Congress, walking up to him and shaking his hand.

Rep. Ellison: Again, I could be a little boy about it crying, "Oh I don't like him cause he was mean to me." Or I can say, "Look here man, this is not about me or you, we're here to work for the American people." And I'm going to put that first every time. I'm not a butt kisser and I don't need him to like me. At the same time, I'm not going to allow him to walk around saying that, "Ellison won't even speak to me, and that's why I won't work with him." No, no, no... when I reached out to him, I put the ball in his court and said, "Be a man, be a statesman, stand up and represent your constituents. Don't be a little kid. Don't go cry in the corner about who you don't like because they're different from you." That's the thing. When I went to shake that guy's hand, people told me I was a bigger man than he was. Well, we're always trying to push people towards the good, to get people to act out of their noblest best self. Right? Not your negative small self. We've all got a negative, petty, hater self right? Which self is going to emerge? The noble and generous self, or the petty and small one? And I'm trying to be better than I was yesterday. I'm trying to improve on that. Maybe that will inspire.

I'd like to see a more diverse crowd not afraid to run, a younger crowd. There's a group out there called Wellstone Action, which helps people learn how to manipulate the political system so that they can be effective in it. I'd like to see same day voter registration in every single state. So you don't have to wait around, or get screwed over. I'd like to get rid of all the restrictions that don't let people with felonies vote. I think that if you're living in America, you're paying taxes, and you're subject to the laws of this country, you ought to be able to vote whether you have a criminal record or not. We need to increase the amount that has a say so in their lives. Whatever we have to do to accomplish that, it should be done. Same day voter registration, let felons vote... what else? Maybe we should even have an election holiday, so that work is not a barrier to voter participation. You need to let kids vote, so young people can learn to get involved.

Here's the thing, one of the big problems with people is cynicism. You know? The idea that nothing works, everything sucks, those guys in D.C. are all the same, when people talk like that they're handing power over because they're frustrated. You're handing your power over, your individual power, because you feel frustrated with government. Never hand your power over. Never do that. If you think you don't like the politicians running, run your damn self. Get up and project a new vision that brings us all in. The changes in our country, and there have been a lot of them, have not been made by people who were easily frustrated. People told Martin Luther King he couldn't change America. They told him it had always been the way it was and that he might as well just quit. And he didn't. Thank God he didn't. You know what I'm saying? People would tell folks fighting to end the Vietnam War that there was nothing that could be done. They got up there in the street and made change. Today we have to have the same kind of courage, the same kind of resolve, and we have to fight back cynicism because we can't let cynicism take over.

BallerStatus.com: How great an influence was Minister Farrakhan on you?

Rep. Ellison: Not much. I don't have anything bad to say about him, he's a bold individual with strong things to say, but I believe that people of all colors are brothers and sisters. I'm an African-American, but I don't subscribe to the view that it's only about black people. So me and him don't agree on that. I agree that women are equal to men. We don't agree on that. I don't believe there's anything wrong with being gay, if that's the way God made you. We don't agree on that. I believe it's not about having African-Americans separate and have their own society. It's about all people who are hard working and make the world go round, coming together in unity with the others to provide a better quality of life for everyone. He and I, we have things we don't agree with.

Malcolm X was an influence on me. He was a man who came up out of the streets, saw the worst that America had to offer, got involved with the Nation of Islam and gained confidence, but then when he saw it was really about all of us, he embraced that idea. He accepted the people of all colors were brothers and sisters. He's a man who kept learning and kept growing and never stopped. Ultimately before his death, he reached the idea that it's about everybody. It's not a matter of what color you are. God made all the colors so they're all good.

BallerStatus.com: How avid is your affection for music?

Rep. Ellison: I like music a lot. Like I said I still listen to Public Enemy. I like Common. Most of the music I listen to now is stuff that my kids have. I'm 43, my oldest son is 19, but I was fortunate enough to have grown up on The Sugarhill Gang. And then there was Run DMC, and in college, I was listening to Brand Nubian. So we've got a lot in common because the hip-hop he listens to is really just a later iteration of the hip-hop I started listening to. We share that. Of course I don't like some of the stuff. I know that rap has a lot of good in it; there's a lot of positive messages out there. Everybody points out the crap. You know what? It's not all crap. So I don't misjudge it and say, "Oh there's misogyny in hop-hop." There's misogyny in hip-hop, but if you listen to country and western, there's a whole lot of misogyny in that too. If you listen to any music... you show me some music where it's all about peace and love in every song. It's not like that. I've still got appreciation for the 60s jazz. I still like Ornette Coleman. I still like Miles Davis. One of my favorite songs is "A Love Supreme" by Coltrane. That will never end, but I also like the version Branford Marsalis did. That is my favorite tune.

BallerStatus.com: Let's allow you to get back to work. There's a certain balding man from Wyoming who needs to be indicted and put in prison.

Rep. Ellison: Let me just say that you can do anything you want if you just put you're mind to it. I know a lot of people say that, but it's absolutely true. Don't let cynicism take you over. Always have hope that things can get better. Nothing changes unless you do the work. You have to get out there, organize, with people who have common ideas and make those changes. Reach out to your brother Keith. I'm looking forward to hearing what anyone has to say. My phone is never off the hook. If there's something you don't like, let your representative know. And if they don't listen, let another representative or I know, and we'll embarrass them on the House floor for having not picked up the phone. I grew up in a household where the civil rights movement was close by. My mother's from Louisiana in the Deep South. She grew up with those "whites only" signs. They're not there any more. They're not up any more for a reason though.

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